Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

Discussion issues on Beer Cans,, Breweriana, Attended Shows etc...

Moderators: Forum Moderator, Current Officers, Previous Officers

User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#1

Post by Beverlx »

You know what I mean. The brand name is on an incline. And if it's on an incline, the left end is the low end. I mean, always. Or so close to always that the exceptions seem weird to us.

Examples, low left to high right:

Only Schlitz. Miller. Regal Pale. Fisher. Falstaff. Goebel. Rainier. Columbia, Bosch, Blanchard's, Old Bohemian, Hauenstein, Koehler (got a shimmy in it but it rises), POC, Knickerbocker, Sterling, Storz, Utica Club, Tivoli, Walter's, sunburst Hamm's. Don't add more. There's no point. They all step up.

@menke raised the question in the other design thread this morning: What steps down?

And why does this rule hold? Maybe Barry or somebody else with more design sophistication can answer this.

I have a couple weak examples of step-down design. Here comes.


User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#2

Post by Beverlx »

Stepdowns.jpg
These are both awkward. Yes, the ABC steps down. But as it's letters, not a single word, I'm putting an asterisk on it. The blue can is actively trying to run interference for the step-down with the different shapes around the letters, like it's a freaking circus or something.

I've always thought of these early Regal Pale ovals with the three banners as the inside-out Regals, but never thought about why until this week of working at home in my basement with a thousand cans staring me back all day. But even these banners start rising and end rising. Asterisk.
User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#3

Post by Beverlx »

s-l500.jpg
s-l500.jpg (18.61 KiB) Viewed 2548 times
Bilow Oktoberfest Beer. Here's an honest-to-God moment of stepdown -- but remember that it hails from Bilow, which is like the Edison Labs of horrible looking cans. The only time that Bilow turned down a bad idea is when they were sure they had something worse in the pipeline.

Only one word out of three steps down -- well, Beer looks a little weak too, now that I look at it. That's good enough for me. Beggars can't be choosers.
User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#4

Post by Beverlx »

Swinger can.jpg
Swinger. As my daughter used to say: awkward turtle. The design here has always reminded me of a plumbing clog more than anything else. (See it once and you'll never unsee it. They should have called it Plunger.)

Swinger is a bona fide exception to the rule. And a hot mess.
User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#5

Post by Beverlx »

I mean, I am sure we'll find craft cans that break this rule, because craft cans have exploded in a design-free hellscape. Apologies to the few breweries with a little self-respect, but you know what I'm saying.

But Rusty brethren, help me. Are there other examples of this?

And what is the thinking behind the unwritten law here?
User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#6

Post by Beverlx »

GBX malt liquor.jpg
GBX. Asterisk because it's not on an incline -- it plunges straight to hell. But it makes the thread.
User avatar
Longopener
RB Roster
RB Roster
Posts: 4207
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:17 am
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 417
BCCA Number: 29470
eBay name: Longopener
Year Started Collecting: 1976
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Has thanked: 36 times
Been thanked: 151 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#7

Post by Longopener »

Does this can count?
Attachments
Druris2.JPG
Druris1.JPG
"Although the cans will be of no value after opened, their cost is expected to be small..." Iowa: June 22, 1935

Why drive 12 hour one way to dig Pre-Tax Tru Blu ales, Genny 12 Horse Longopeners, Gamecock Ales, Apollos, Neuweilers Bock, and Krueger’s Baldies when you can locally drive 10 hours round trip and dig Pfeiffer, Goebel, Drewrys and Strohs?
User avatar
Rockbob
Rust Governor
Rust Governor
Posts: 4893
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 8:49 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 824
BCCA Number: 30760
eBay name: rockbobford
Year Started Collecting: 1974
Location: Right here
Has thanked: 23 times
Been thanked: 55 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#8

Post by Rockbob »

I think the "step up" rule symbolizes positivity. "Hey, look at me, buy me!" The "step down" approach seems negative. Like a, "here I am, take your chances" vibe.
RockBob, Rocko, Rockford Bob, Pinhead
Collector of all things from Chicago and cans I dig
Ironguts Union #11
Uncle Jackson
Rust Master General
Rust Master General
Posts: 525
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2010 9:09 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 929
BCCA Number: 953
eBay name: JLC0953
Year Started Collecting: 1969
Location: North East, PA
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 107 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#9

Post by Uncle Jackson »

On the design issue, from a marketing class 45 years ago, upward trends are positive, downward are negative. Your eye and focus subconsciously follow that logic. The counter logic is that uphill is hard, but downhill is easy, but, apparently, our subconscious does not work that way.

My 2 cents.
Jerry Cole
User avatar
Barry Travis
RB Graphic Artist
RB Graphic Artist
Posts: 2525
Joined: Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:29 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 666
BCCA Number: 30938
eBay name: internut
Year Started Collecting: 1996
Location: St.Paul,MN.
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 43 times
Zodiac:
Contact:
Status: Offline
St Kitts-Nevis

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#10

Post by Barry Travis »

Jerry
You beat me to it. Ascension and lifting up. And another unwritten rule seems to be three letters or less. Like with ABC, or the initials of a person, you can digest that visually without too much trouble. But throw a type face like old English in there and all bets are off.

I guess I’m more surprised that I got a mention for a design related question.😁
Buying your old beer stuff!
Call/text 612-578-2613
oldbeer@gmail.com

http://ibuyoldbeer.com
User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#11

Post by Beverlx »

I talk to my students all the time about symbol and ideology -- the way that we link height with exaltation, depth (or ground level) with abasement. In religion, in design, in language. And so this makes sense to me.

Weird too because it seems to pronounce the time it takes us to read "Schlitz" as significant. Not "I am seeing a word placed on an incline," but "I am engaging in the process of getting from S to Z, and during that process, things are going up."

Typographic corollary -- brand names begin, conventionally, with capital letters, which, again conventionally, are larger in most scripts. Is it more emotionally reassuring to have Schlitz anchored, figuratively, by the big S, instead of having that big S high, which we might read as "up in the air"?

@Uncle Jackson: Jerry, I wonder whether that upward trend principle derives from the line chart (a quick lap on Wikipedia suggests that they're 300 years old or so) or whether the upward sweep was taught us by theology, architecture, our symbolic reading of landscape? Where are the roots of our believing that upward is positive?
User avatar
Beverlx
RB Treasurer
RB Treasurer
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:53 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 677
BCCA Number: 18483
eBay name: beverlx
Year Started Collecting: 1977
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 263 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#12

Post by Beverlx »

@Barry Travis, happy birthday!
User avatar
Rand
Rust Governor
Rust Governor
Posts: 4955
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2006 6:46 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 727
BCCA Number: 28177
Year Started Collecting: 1967
Location: Yosemite National Park, CA
Has thanked: 415 times
Been thanked: 493 times
Zodiac:
Contact:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#13

Post by Rand »

Was only able to find one pseudo example among my OI pictures or Beer Can't pictures, and that's a UK beer called "Long Life"....while the "Long Life" is horizontal, their "LL" logo does go down and to the right..... the example I have is one of those L1 Retractable Can Piercers/Openers:
IMG_5801.jpg
Rand "The Can't Man" Lindsly....Foot Soldier in the OI Wars....Honorably Discharged
"I'm a solipsist and, I have to say, I'm surprised there aren't more of us."
Acme. Genesee. - Feigenspan Uinta
User avatar
golf_lover44
Grand Marshall of Rust
Grand Marshall of Rust
Posts: 1800
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2013 7:57 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 0
BCCA Number: 34341
Year Started Collecting: 2013
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 482 times
Status: Offline

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#14

Post by golf_lover44 »

Rhinelander from Huber. It's closer to a vertical name than it is an inclined name.

Image
golf_lover44
BCCA #34341
Collector of current micro and craft brewery cans from Chicago and the USA
User avatar
mtracy64
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3252
Joined: Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:59 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 353
BCCA Number: 27810
eBay name: mtracy64
Year Started Collecting: 1975
Location: Rochester, MI
Has thanked: 410 times
Been thanked: 826 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#15

Post by mtracy64 »

Rand wrote: Thu Mar 26, 2020 3:06 pm Was only able to find one pseudo example among my OI pictures or Beer Can't pictures, and that's a UK beer called "Long Life"....while the "Long Life" is horizontal, their "LL" logo does go down and to the right..... the example I have is one of those L1 Retractable Can Piercers/Openers:

IMG_5801.jpg
Have you considered the possibility that "LL" goes up and to the left? After all, you're dealing with people who drive on the wrong side of the road . . .

Marc
User avatar
Rand
Rust Governor
Rust Governor
Posts: 4955
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2006 6:46 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 727
BCCA Number: 28177
Year Started Collecting: 1967
Location: Yosemite National Park, CA
Has thanked: 415 times
Been thanked: 493 times
Zodiac:
Contact:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#16

Post by Rand »

mtracy64 wrote: Thu Mar 26, 2020 4:16 pm
Rand wrote: Thu Mar 26, 2020 3:06 pm Was only able to find one pseudo example among my OI pictures or Beer Can't pictures, and that's a UK beer called "Long Life"....while the "Long Life" is horizontal, their "LL" logo does go down and to the right..... the example I have is one of those L1 Retractable Can Piercers/Openers:

IMG_5801.jpg
Have you considered the possibility that "LL" goes up and to the left? After all, you're dealing with people who drive on the wrong side of the road . . .

Marc
Hummmm.....interesting theory. However, I would posit that the "L" on top of the multi-L stack would be the beginning of the Long Life acronym pile. While the learned assembly here is busily stroking their Freudian beards on the thorny issue as to whether the cursive logo text correctly elevates manfully from lower left to upper right, or droops pathetically from upper left to lower right......I think all would agree that a "front to back" convention in text order is a universal standard.

QED
Rand "The Can't Man" Lindsly....Foot Soldier in the OI Wars....Honorably Discharged
"I'm a solipsist and, I have to say, I'm surprised there aren't more of us."
Acme. Genesee. - Feigenspan Uinta
User avatar
willssoda
Rust Governor
Rust Governor
Posts: 2985
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:04 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 1063
eBay name: WILLSSODA
Year Started Collecting: 1975
Location: East Tennessee
Has thanked: 528 times
Been thanked: 439 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#17

Post by willssoda »

My 2cents. Books are written left to right cause that’s how we read. Reading upward is a positive thing and more natural than reading downward.
Interested in all flat and Cone Soda and Water cans.
User avatar
pinnacle-project
Rust Governor
Rust Governor
Posts: 4645
Joined: Sun May 19, 2013 1:23 pm
Answers: 0
Rusty Bunch Member Number: 1111
eBay name: pinnacle-project
Year Started Collecting: 1975
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Has thanked: 1118 times
Been thanked: 1285 times
Zodiac:
Status: Offline
United States of America

Re: Design question 2: why do diagonal brand names always rise left to right?

#18

Post by pinnacle-project »

willssoda wrote: Fri Mar 27, 2020 5:54 pm My 2cents. Books are written left to right cause that’s how we read. Reading upward is a positive thing and more natural than reading downward.
In English we read left to right but that is not true in Arabic. So does this mean all these design ideas do not apply to Arabic products?
Focus: Cones and flats from Michigan, South Bend, and Fort Wayne. Foreign cans only if I bought them myself in the country of origin.

2023 Shows Attended

* Michigan Chapter Winterfest, January 14, Frankenmuth Michigan
* Cabin Fever Reliever, February 24, Mishawaka Indiana
* Buckeye, March 11, Toledo Ohio
* SummerSwap, July 21 & 22, Frankenmuth Michigan
Post Reply Previous topicNext topic

Return to “General Discussion”