Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
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- Rust Master
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
It's my old can, and yes it is the same can that is in the book. I always thought it was probably real, but over the years while I had the can the views of those who looked at it were 50/50. I don't recall the canning code, but it was the same as the flat, which didn't help its chances. The first time I sold it the buyer gave it some thought and decided it was a flat and sent it back. So it is a big question mark. Could not confirm either way. Matt
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
can we see a pic of the reverse ?
sometimes the notches in the seam are a good clue .
sometimes the notches in the seam are a good clue .
To me it makes Goog Goog sense !
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
I would think by having the flat & setting it side by side with the cone you should see certain subtle differences that should confirm it's real, or not. Has anybody ever done that before. LEON.
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
I agree with Ohio can guy-legit. Doesn’t seem to be a stretch to me at all. Dating back to the black HP cones, they have always come in pairs, including the version with “brewed and packed by” on the face. Burger made both beer and ale oval labels in flats and the oval label beer in a cone. Why would they suddenly stop producing in pairs like that and not put out an oval labeled ale cone? Doesn’t make sense
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
I see few differences in front on Cone all of shield looks black on flat have black have green that pic? And the "R" registered is not on Cone but on flat? Looking at pics
Last edited by oldcrowncollector on Sat May 19, 2018 11:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Oldcrowncollector
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
With all due respect to everyone involved, and their opinions... I honestly don't see how anyone could think this can was the flat with a cone added. At least not the flat pictured in the USBC. UNLESS, the flat was cut down and then repainted. The "can" portion of a flat and cone are simply not the same size. If the cone in question is the same height as any other high pro cone, then it is very likely real. To get the flat to cone height, one would have to do extensive metal work and then repaint the can. Have you black lighted it?
Not having held the can, I can't attest to condition. It could have had the cone lid replaced at some point and that is what is causing concern. Again, correct height?
Below is a side by side of the beer version of this can, flat to cone. Look in the book, Ale/Beer versions are very, very similar in almost every respect. Notice the line just below/above the top/bottom rim on the can. Cutting the flat down would cause that to disappear. It looks fully intact on the Ale Cone can.
Also, as a comparison, below is the earlier IRTP Beer/Ale version of this can and later Beer/Ale flat version. As stated, Burger consistently produced both beer and ale versions for many years.
So... IMHO... if correct height and no signs of major paintwork, it's REAL.
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.
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Bob
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
Well, you proved my point, That's why I asked for side by side comparison. I've had this same discussion in here many times before, many years ago & every few years the same question comes up again. Anytime you put the identical cone & flat together you will see that since the cone is a shorter can it's label is slightly shrunken down to a smaller size to fit the smaller can (or spacing moved tighter) with this can all you need to do is measure the distance between the black lines at top & bottom of both cans to see they are not the same. cutting the flat down would eliminate the flats top black line.. LEON.
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
Will somebody show the backsides of the cans to see if there is a Cap-Sealed panel? I would think that would be the best way to settle this discussion.
Chris E.
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
For other rare cans the English Lad cones and White horse from Chicago. Tom H
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
The canning codes on my matching beer flat and cone are the same, so I don’t see that as an issue here
Also Chris Eib, the oval beer cone does not have any cap sealed panel so I expect the ale doesn’t either
quote="Matt Menghini" post_id=380595 time=1526642780 user_id=111]
It's my old can, and yes it is the same can that is in the book. I always thought it was probably real, but over the years while I had the can the views of those who looked at it were 50/50. I don't recall the canning code, but it was the same as the flat, which didn't help its chances. The first time I sold it the buyer gave it some thought and decided it was a flat and sent it back. So it is a big question mark. Could not confirm either way. Matt
[/quote]
Also Chris Eib, the oval beer cone does not have any cap sealed panel so I expect the ale doesn’t either
quote="Matt Menghini" post_id=380595 time=1526642780 user_id=111]
It's my old can, and yes it is the same can that is in the book. I always thought it was probably real, but over the years while I had the can the views of those who looked at it were 50/50. I don't recall the canning code, but it was the same as the flat, which didn't help its chances. The first time I sold it the buyer gave it some thought and decided it was a flat and sent it back. So it is a big question mark. Could not confirm either way. Matt
[/quote]
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
double click pic.
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
Fox deluxe from Grand Rapids
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
Hi all, I finally had the time to photograph all 4 of the related cans. I believe the photos indicates the can is legit. The canning codes are as follow (can probably be seen in t he photo)
Beer Flat(46-17)-CCC no number
All the rest(46-12,155-29 and 155-21)-CCC 72.
Thanks,
-Chris
Beer Flat(46-17)-CCC no number
All the rest(46-12,155-29 and 155-21)-CCC 72.
Thanks,
-Chris
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
It sure looks legit to me for reasons already posted. I am not sure why the heck this is even debated? Just because no dumpers have been found?
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
My 2 cents worth-
While Zeiglers is a tough cone, there are just too many out there to be a $1000+ can,
and most are indoor!
Some real Hp toughies that should be $1000+ (in my humble opinion) include;
Arrowhead 150-21
Blitz 153-29
Breunigs 3.2% 154-22
Breunigs strong 154-23
Buffalo Hp 155-15
Chevalier DNCMT 4% 157-17
Copper Club strong 158-15
Diamond State 159-11
Gobbons Hp, NL- not listed
either Grain Belt ale 166-24 & 25
Keeley Lager DNCMT 4% NL
Old Tap Brand 178-05
Pilsers Ale 179-12
Red Wing- no % NL
76 ale- green drum, 185-10
Silver Fox, from Oklahoma, 185-21
Interesting how so many on this list are from the midwest.
Keep turning those cans, ‘cause you never know what you might find.
Cheers, Neil
While Zeiglers is a tough cone, there are just too many out there to be a $1000+ can,
and most are indoor!
Some real Hp toughies that should be $1000+ (in my humble opinion) include;
Arrowhead 150-21
Blitz 153-29
Breunigs 3.2% 154-22
Breunigs strong 154-23
Buffalo Hp 155-15
Chevalier DNCMT 4% 157-17
Copper Club strong 158-15
Diamond State 159-11
Gobbons Hp, NL- not listed
either Grain Belt ale 166-24 & 25
Keeley Lager DNCMT 4% NL
Old Tap Brand 178-05
Pilsers Ale 179-12
Red Wing- no % NL
76 ale- green drum, 185-10
Silver Fox, from Oklahoma, 185-21
Interesting how so many on this list are from the midwest.
Keep turning those cans, ‘cause you never know what you might find.
Cheers, Neil
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
The Blitz cone is not real - at least not in the sense it held beer or was ever a production can. One theory is a mock-up by the can company that was probably made from a flat. You can tell the bottom has been cut down because the logo is lopped off. This one came from the estate of a brewery executive. It's not my can and these are the best photos I have but at least you can see the back.
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
My apologies.
I thought the Blitz cone was real. I had never heard it was a mock up.
It is strange that the one pictured above is a different can than the one in the USBC.
The one in the book has different scratches-
so that means there are at least 2 mock up cans known??
Neil
I thought the Blitz cone was real. I had never heard it was a mock up.
It is strange that the one pictured above is a different can than the one in the USBC.
The one in the book has different scratches-
so that means there are at least 2 mock up cans known??
Neil
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Re: Tough Hi Pro cones with USBC <$1000+ value
Both Blitz "cone" variations were for sale online at one point for $5000 grand for the pair. No idea if they sold....if they did it must have been a record for a non-legit can?
Eric
Eric