Facebook site 'Brewerianna buy sell trade' moderator

[Wrestling Nut]

I know some of you help moderate Facebook sites. I was wondering if anyone helps with this site, Brewerianna buy sell trade. Asking because I, like most, am beyond tired of this nonsense.it may have already been removed but it popped up on my page within the last hour.

Thanks
Brad

[keithker]

@mattski323

[keithker]

@Wrestling Nut Matt can't find that post in BBST @Sea Monkey posted it in numerous groups Sure it was BBST?

[Wrestling Nut]

Not certain. My apologies if I'm incorrect. It looks like it was taken down now. Thank you.

Unfortunately I can't fit the entire thing in a single screen shot but I took two and have provided them here. So everyone can see what I'm referring to.

[keithker]

@Wrestling Nut Brad sadly I don't know who the moderators are for Beer Can Collectors Wanted.....

Hopefully @Sea Monkey Scott asked them to delete it and might want to consider removing him.....

[jinsequa]

Just going to keep my mouth shut on this one.

[kb]

I'm clueless as usual and dont even know or see what the issue is ?? Maybe its better that way... dug a Carnegie HP once

[Sea Monkey]

@Wrestling Nut Brad sadly I don't know who the moderators are for Beer Can Collectors Wanted.....

Hopefully @Sea Monkey Scott asked them to delete it and might want to consider removing him.....

I deleted it...

[renokenn]

I'm with KB - explain to us non facebook users.

[Kevin the Ex-Editor]

It's the dreaded flat sheet fiasco.

[ConeAddict]

The BC+ guys came here and addressed this, I suspect the can was shillled(not by BC+ but by the owner or his pals) but without evidence and what from what we know the can was purchased legally. Like someone else said in another thread getting the flat sheet for $25 was such an underpay that I wouldn't complain if it fell through.


That said, there is another dealer who flat out tells us we may shilled by the auctioneer himself and while it has been covered I really can't believe there hasn't been more made of it here. He has never addressed it here or changed the policy despite plenty of posts about it. I know this isn't going to make me popular here but it have been stewing about this for a while and feel it needs to be said, I would gladly pay more dues here if it means not allowing sellers like this to advertise on our chapter site. JMO

[jinsequa]

The BC+ guys came here and addressed this, I suspect the can was shillled(not by BC+ but by the owner or his pals) but without evidence and what from what we know the can was purchased legally. Like someone else said in another thread getting the flat sheet for $25 was such an underpay that I wouldn't complain if it fell through.


That said, there is another dealer who flat out tells us we may shilled by the auctioneer himself and while it has been covered I really can't believe there hasn't been more made of it here. He has never addressed it here or changed the policy despite plenty of posts about it. I know this isn't going to make me popular here but it have been stewing about this for a while and feel it needs to be said, I would gladly pay more dues here if it means not allowing sellers like this to advertise on our chapter site. JMO

I thought I could keep my mouth shut....but I can't. Here is my unbiased run down as I see it for inquiring minds.

1. Sheet is purchased on ebay for $25 buy it now in 2017. Original Buyer makes find of his life in his area of collecting.
2. Another ethically challenged vulture of a collector with very deep monetary pockets who browses completed sales on ebay for just such an event contacts ebay seller and makes him an offer he doesn't refuse for the sheet that was already sold to someone else.
3. Ebay seller cancels the sale and the original seller gets thoroughly dicked out of the find of his life that he thought he had purchased and was his rightfully his.
4. Ebay seller tells original purchaser he "lost" the flat sheet and refunds the money. New Jersey law where the original seller lived supports the can still being his since listed as "lost". Ebay rules don't support the original buyers claim.
5. Original purchaser who got dicked out of the flat sheet posted about his experience on Rusty Bunch-facebook when it happened in 2017 and hoped that reputable individuals who roll cans would not roll this one due to it's shaky provenance and shaky legal status as "lost".
6. Can gets professionally rolled anyways.
7. Can shows up for sale on BC+ website last auction.
8. Original ebay purchaser who got dicked wrongly blames BC+ for the ethical failures of the deep pocketed completed sale vulture and the original ebay seller. BC+ was an unwitting participant in this mess and quickly and with clarity demonstrated they have no responsibility here and did nothing wrong.
9. Total silence out of those who rolled the can professionally was noted.
10. Subsequently, there has been a concerted and coordinated effort to shut down any and all comments by the original purchaser on multiple sites, even including attempts to get him banned from various sites for airing his legitimate grievance. (The BC+ comments rightfully have been shut down since they crossed the line IMO but the original purchaser certainly should be able to air his grievance about the ethically challenged completed sale vulture who contacted the original seller and got him to cancel the sale.)
10. There have been all types of ethical and moral gymnastics done by some trying to justify the actions of the completed sale vulture who intercepted the can after it was originally purchased that try to place the blame for this fiasco on the original buyer ("He bought it too cheap", "It wasn't his until it arrived in his mailbox", etc.) but honestly the guy got dicked out of the find of his life by some ethically challenged, deep pocketed vulture of a collector and has a legitimate grievance, little legal standing and little recourse. I understand the original buyer being angry but he needs to focus his anger on the right individuals. He currently is using a shotgun approach and blaming any and all involved. He is not helping his case with his shotgun approach.
11. Now claims of shilling in the auction for the can are out there by the completed sale vulture or his friends. (If this claim is substantiated, It seems like it is the completed sale vulture that is harmful to the hobby in general and should be the one who the coordinated and concerted effort to shut down should be directed towards?)
12. It all comes down to a case of "right vs. wrong". Some out there believe that nothing wrong was done by completed sale vulture because money talks and they point out "nothing illegal" was done. Others see a lot of wrong happening here period whether it was illegal or not.

That is my two cent run down of this fiasco as someone with no dog in this fight.

[Cap-Sealed]

You are beating a dead horse.... guy who lost out on American Draft needs to move on and quit being a spazz....it happens. We all have been screwed out of a deal or two.

[Sea Monkey]

from above ...
#10 there has been a concerted and coordinated effort to shut down any and all comments by the original purchaser on multiple sites, even including attempts to get him banned from various sites for airing his legitimate grievance.

You may not be privy to the very serious stated and implied threats being made Via PM and other methods to MULTIPLE RB members. They are extremely disturbing. Believe me when I tell you he EARNED his RB banishment over and over. His tirades toward people that have no connection to his story is nothing short of insane. As a direct result of his threats, one person has gone as far as purchasing a security system for their home. ANOTHER person had a picture OF HIS FAMILY stolen off the internet and this guy made a fake account and used the RB's member family picture as HIS fake account's profile picture.
The guy got screwed by the ebay seller/2nd buyer but is going full on crazy towards people that have NOTHING to do with the situation. This is a VERY SERIOUS situation...

[Ctbott1]

Do we know who the eBay buyer was who browsed the completed auctions and contacted the seller?

[bodean]

Holy cow! All this over a beer can?

[Ed Johnson]

@bodean - I could see this over that killer Ye Tavern beer light that is your avatar!

Great sign!

[kb]

Wow - i do read FB for our beer can sites but I only meant I was clueless as to why Scott’s QWART sales we’re being Brought up on this post .. but never realized it went deeper into that flat sheet saga .. and now after Scott describes what this dude did, I now realize who got compromised - man this dude is got some issues

[Sea Monkey]

My Quart post was mentioned ONLY because one of his fake Facebook pages persona commented on that “You r lucky BC+ didn’t steal them.” I have been lucky to not be in his crosshairs nearly as much as some others.

[kb]

My Quart post was mentioned ONLY because one of his fake Facebook pages persona commented on that “You r lucky BC+ didn’t steal them.” I have been lucky to not be in his crosshairs nearly as much as some others.

now i see, though BC meant because + stole soemthing... and recall his clint eastwood profile pic F***ing with one of our guys!! effed up

[Ctbott1]

I don’t know anyone involved but if someone scumbagged me like that on what is likely the find of a lifetime for someone - I can understand why they are pissed.

[Mizmo64]

I don’t know anyone involved but if someone scumbagged me like that on what is likely the find of a lifetime for someone - I can understand why they are pissed.

I do not believe anyone disagrees with this. It has happened many times over and to many collectors. It totally sucks. It is just how he has handled the whole situation. Trust me let him direct some of the e-mails, PM's, social media posts, ect that he has at you and you may take a little different position. The whole scorched earth approach that he has taken is what has cost him the sympathetic ear of many.

[kamsquared]

So this story is actually about a person who was selling a can on eBay that ended up getting a better deal because someone was more honest on the purchase price of a rare can.
I understand that we all revel in finding that Holy Grail can in a crawl space or from someone on eBay who knows nothing about the value of beer cans. But do you just take the can out of the crawl space and not tell the owner of the house? Sounds like theft to me....
Would the same collectors that brag about finding fantastic deals in the dollar box at can shows do the same if that can were in their friends tote? ……or would you tell them the value so they wouldn’t get “ripped off”?
We all do it, where do we draw the line?
Morality : a particular system of values and principles of conduct, especially one held by a specified person or society.

[Ctbott1]

So this story is actually about a person who was selling a can on eBay that ended up getting a better deal because someone was more honest on the purchase price of a rare can.
I understand that we all revel in finding that Holy Grail can in a crawl space or from someone on eBay who knows nothing about the value of beer cans. But do you just take the can out of the crawl space and not tell the owner of the house? Sounds like theft to me....
Would the same collectors that brag about finding fantastic deals in the dollar box at can shows do the same if that can were in their friends tote? ……or would you tell them the value so they wouldn’t get “ripped off”?
We all do it, where do we draw the line?
Morality : a particular system of values and principles of conduct, especially one held by a specified person or society.

Sorry - this argument doesn’t hold water. If someone is selling something on eBay as an auction or BIN than that’s the price. I’ve had good deals at auctions and also had things crap the bed that I was selling and I lose money on it.

This is NOT the same as someone responding to an advertisement or finding something in an attic etc. in those cases - I think you should be honest if you know what you’re looking at. I’ve also lost out buying stuff for what I thought was a fair price just to find out later I overpaid and could never recover what I spent.

Suggesting that someone who wins an item off eBay should them contact the seller to let them know it was a great deal is absurd.

[kruegerbock]

Trust me, the person who contacts the seller after the item is purchased is not doing this out of any altruistic thought at all. Once in a while they are doing it so they can get a great item at a low price for their own collection. Most of the time, they are doing it so they can make money reselling the item.

[kamsquared]

I knew my opinion would be a bit controversial and it is only my opinion. I appreciate the comments and I think it's an important conversation.
However, I don't think that contacting a seller to let them know the true value of what they have is absurd. I'm also not naive enough to think that the person(s) who contacted the seller had the sellers best interest in mind.....they most likely they did not. My comment about the buyer being "honest" might have been a bit too optimistic.
I do think that we all need to keep in mind the uneducated folks in our hobby who may not know the value. This site is all about educating people on the rare, the scarce, the desirable, and even the common cans that we all have knowledge on. I'm not trying to sound "Holier Than Thou" but please think about your fellow collectors and non-collectors.
In the immortal words of Earl Hickey, "Karma is a Bitch".

[DURTBAGG]

Curious how many people have found cans at flea markets/yard sales at great prices? What did you do?

Say you find a can at a flea market for $5 that is worth $400 in todays market.

What did you do? Did you pay the $5 asking price, then ask if they had any other cans for sale, or did you hand them 4 Benjamin’s and then educate them?

[oldindiapaleale]

It is called cherry picking, a term from coin collecting.

In which there are collectors in all collecting hobbies, who educate themselves and learn to look for variations or rarities that are offered by sellers who are not aware of what they are selling.

They are smart. They go to yard sales, public auctions, estate sales, flea markets and collectors shows. And now over the internet through craigslist, facebook, ebay and other websites. They are smart.

So, did anybody ever go to a can show, looking to buy, and said to the seller that "this is a tough can, only a couple known, here's your dollar."

I know that friends of friends within the hobby would look out for each other in regards to pricing and rarities but once you become the 'seller' then it is up to you to check out values and sales pricing.

If you are unsure, ask another collector, is this worth something? Get the advice, check ebay asking/selling prices. Ask the rusty bunch. Do your homework.

[Ctbott1]

I’ve been all over the place with the scenarios in this thread.

I’ve been in coins longer than anything and have bought and sold rarities that I’ve known about and I didn’t know about. Someone who cherry picks my coins because they know more than me and spot something I missed - good for them.

Again, I view it differently then if I was asked to review grandpas old collection - which is have. I painstakingly go through it to be honest and fair and often times recommend they take certain coins to certain venues.

For bottles - I’ve been burned and I’ve done good.

Cans for me are new. However, we did score cans at a tag sale that we bought as part of a large group of bottles. I honestly had no idea what they were when we bought them as part of the group. They were a home run - so should I go back to the seller who had the yard sale and tell them?

My feeling on this is pretty cut and dry. If you put something in an auction - it’s fair game. Private sales, even tag sales, Facebook etc. when you have the ability to interact one on one - I always try to be as fair and honest as I can.

However, you get burned too. I recently paid 1200 bucks for a pair of porcelain signs. I told the owner I thought they were worth 1600 to the right guy so I thought I could make a few bucks.

Guess what - I sold them for 900 - I was wrong - it happens

[DURTBAGG]

It is called cherry picking, a term from coin collecting.

In which there are collectors in all collecting hobbies, who educate themselves and learn to look for variations or rarities that are offered by sellers who are not aware of what they are selling.

They are smart. They go to yard sales, public auctions, estate sales, flea markets and collectors shows. And now over the internet through craigslist, facebook, ebay and other websites. They are smart.

So, did anybody ever go to a can show, looking to buy, and said to the seller that "this is a tough can, only a couple known, here's your dollar."

I know that friends of friends within the hobby would look out for each other in regards to pricing and rarities but once you become the 'seller' then it is up to you to check out values and sales pricing.

If you are unsure, ask another collector, is this worth something? Get the advice, check ebay asking/selling prices. Ask the rusty bunch. Do your homework.

This is my point exactly. All of the cans in the below pic have been plucked from flea markets/antique stores by me going back to the mid ‘80s when I was a teenager. Seller had it priced where they wanted and I paid asking price-done deal. Lowest price $2.........highest $50. At the end of the day, all parties were happy!