11oz Flat Top Cans

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11oz Flat Top Cans

#1

Post by MI-Cans » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:50 am

* * * I changed the topic because it wasn't as much about Hawaii cans as it was about Brewers' battles against tax issues. * * *

At the Toledo show, one of my pickups was an 11oz Coors Flat Top. I think it’s my first 11oz can. I was aware of 10 ouncers as I have several. Never gave it much thought until now. Looking through your Newspaper Archive, I noticed that in the late 50’s, domestic brands were advertising 11oz cans in Hawaii newspapers.

I know that the original Primo aluminum can was 11oz. Does anyone have any info on why the one ounce difference apparently became so prevalent in Hawaii? Looking through the Volume One Supplement, the first 40 or so 11oz cans that I found, the majority were by West Coast Brewers. Has anyone ever done an 11oz Composite?

I’d appreciate anyone sharing what they know about these 11 ounce cans. Thanks!

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Click to enlarge.
1958-10-10 HONOLULU, HI.png
I wonder if all 36 brands had 11oz cans?
1959-09-11 HONOLULU, HI.PNG
1960-01-28 HONOLULU, HI (1).PNG
1959-09-17 HONOLULU, HI.png
1960-01-12 HONOLULU, HI.PNG
11oz Cans.jpg
These are the 11 ounce brands advertised in Honolulu newspaper ads.
Last edited by MI-Cans on Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Late 50’s Hawaii Cans

#2

Post by waste-man » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:07 pm

Wasn't it a tax thing? Some states passed a tax on 12 and 16oz containers.....So they made the cans 11 and 15oz.

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Re: Late 50’s Hawaii Cans

#3

Post by burgiedave » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:16 pm

It was marketing. Price hike necessary many west coast breweries subtracted an ounce. Shoppers were keen on price but majority would not notice content no longer reflected 12 or 16 ounces. This was reconfirmed last fall while, after a 20 year gap, revisited a Sacramento beer distributor. They made their fortune selling Burgermeister. Family operated for over 70 years they always extend the welcome mat when I appear. This topic is discussed when viewing their small can collection, behind the scenes from the general public.

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Re: Late 50’s Hawaii Cans

#4

Post by MI-Cans » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:40 pm

Thanks, Guys.

So, I'll have to check to see if they were advertising the 11oz cans on the mainland as well as in Hawaii. I kept searching the Volume One Supplement and came up with 100 11oz cans. I'll eventually put out a summary listing.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#5

Post by MI-Cans » Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:39 pm

Having researched 11oz cans in Volume One Supplement and with assistance from members on this site, I'm up to 103. The Rainier Jubilee Brewery series 11oz cans deserve a post of their own. (Future project)

(If I missed any, let me know and I'll update whatever needs correcting and updating.) I did break down the numbers by state and it was obvious that states affected by these tax issues had the most cans.

I made collage of them. I also recorded whatever info was available about them in an Excel spreadsheet (so you can add your own notes and I created a PDF of that list for anyone that prefers it that way.

Also found two articles mentioning the connection between taxes and these 11oz cans.

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Click to enlarge.
1959-06-04 LOS ANGELES, CA.png
1959-06-18 LOS ANGELES, CA.png
Here they are by state production:
11oz Count.png
11oz Count.png (7.66 KiB) Viewed 850 times
Here's the collage of 11oz Cans:
VOLUME ONE 11 OUNCE CANS.JPG
Here's the Excel spreadsheet:
11oz COMPOSITE.xlsx
(23.55 KiB) Downloaded 9 times
Here's the PDF version:
11oz COMPOSITE.pdf
(156.18 KiB) Downloaded 10 times
Edited 03-15-2019 - Revised 2 images along with Excel and PDF files to add Finer Flaver can.

Edited 03-15-2019 - Revised 2 images along with Excel and PDF files to add Super X and Black Label cans.

Edited 03-16-2019 - Revised 2 images along with Excel and PDF files to add Red Cap Can and remove Jubilee Cans.
Last edited by MI-Cans on Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:01 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#6

Post by pinnacle-project » Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:53 pm

Interesting. I did not know Goebel has an 11 ounce can made in Detroit. It would have made for more sense for it to be from Oakland.
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#7

Post by MI-Cans » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:28 pm

@pinnacle-project That's what it says on the can...

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Detroit Goebel 11oz.png
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#8

Post by OctoberAle » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:52 pm

The composite is missing the Finer Flaver 11 oz. opening instruction can.
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#9

Post by barfly » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:06 pm

Missing; Rainier Ale, white band at top with Pull Top in the band. Great Info :smt023

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#10

Post by mtracy64 » Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:09 pm

OctoberAle wrote:
Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:52 pm
The composite is missing the Finer Flaver 11 oz. opening instruction can.
Yes, but that can is a completely different animal. It's a 12 oz. can that says 11 oz.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#11

Post by MI-Cans » Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:21 am

All files in Post #5 in this thread revised based on info provided. Thank you.

@OctoberAle Thanks for pointing that out. If that's the only one I missed after scanning through 5K of can images, then I done goog. But I probably missed more which I'll add when notified.

@barfly Thanks for that can. This list was only about Flat Tops. Maybe I'll consider doing one on Pull Tab cans.

@mtracy64 Interesting little fact. Probably easier to use existing can inventory, put in one less ounce and label it as such. Thank you.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#12

Post by Scott » Fri Mar 15, 2019 10:36 am

You are missing the Super X from Utah.
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#13

Post by Rocknchip » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:43 am

I have been in pursuit of all known 11 oz for 10 yrs and have just about everyone in the book...only missing the Rhinelander from Highlander Brewing (that is the first one pictured in the composite that looks pretty rough) also, the KOL from Atlantic that is pictured in the book has never been seen...the common Silver Springs can is quite ubiquitous, I believe there was a find at one time or another ... it has been discussed that there was a mistake in the book or that it was a one of kind because none of the the 11 oz collectors I know have one or have seen one. Perhaps we flush somebody out on this thread. The composite is missing a few... A tuff one not listed is the Super X...I do not see the Black Label 11 oz in the composite either... and there's about 10 11 oz rainier jubes that I know of... could be more variations. And not sure if the finer flavor in the composite photo above is an OI? But indeed, it is a 12 oz can with 11 oz printed on it from what Ive been told. I just sold 12 or so 11 oz cans that Ive upgraded over the past few months! I have a couple Buckhorns, 1 steel and 1 alum flats from Theo Hamms and couple common Rainier 11 oz left for sale - ping me if interested...
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#14

Post by Rocknchip » Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:45 am

I see scott posted info about the Super X as I was crafting my post! Beat me to it!
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#15

Post by Scott » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:53 pm

the 11 oz. Kol from Atlantic, Spokane does exist! I was bored and casually flipped a Kol in a tote of $5 flats at a show in Portland figuring it would be from Tacoma like the hundreds of others I'd checked over the years. After I resumed breathing and got my heartbeat down to a safe level, a deal was quickly made. It's the only one I've ever seen or heard of beside the photo in the book. I can post a photo but it probably won't be until Monday.

I'm still looking for the Rheinlander as well.
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#16

Post by MI-Cans » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:10 pm

All files in Post #5 in this thread revised based on info provided. Thank you.

@Scott Added the Super X. Thanks for the help.

@Rocknchip Added the two Black Labels. I originally found two 11oz Rainier Jubes in the regular Supplement pages. They have a separate Rainier category that I haven't figured out yet. There's a search function that found 4 Jubes in that area. That would only bring me up to six. If there's "X" number in a series, how would they be listed? How many series had 11oz cans? I'll have to do some more research there. Also, thanks for your assistance.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#17

Post by Rocknchip » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:30 pm

Dude! I cannot believe you have the Kol from Atlantic!! Mystery can is no longer a mystery! Ive turned over a lot of KOL's too...I will have to start looking the $1 totes, I walk past them all the time...
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#18

Post by Scott » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:09 pm

There are six Jubilee designs that were made in 11 oz. They are the snowflake, squirrels & balloon, men at table, sundial, grain stalks, and brewer with glass. This was the final set that was also made as 12 oz. zip tabs. There are about 6-8 colors of each so that's 36 to 48. Then you have them from both Seattle and Spokane so double the number. I have most of them so could check on the number of colors when I'm at home. I'll post a picture for you later.

I see you added the Tuxedo 51 - forgot about that one. There are definitely some others when you get into the variations and multiple cities. For example I think (but am not certain) there is a Hamm's with the 11 oz. on the front from San Francisco that's not in the book. The one shown is from Los Angeles and good luck finding one as they are very scarce.
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#19

Post by J. Page » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:59 pm

Some clarification on the Rainier section of the supplement. I have a basic outline of how this will lay out and we are still trying to figure out
how to get most of the colors inserted. I currently have about 350 cans photographed without really searching them out.
The main difference with this section is that it is set up more like a database that you search for specific cans that you want to see. The search parameters are:
Set: (here is a breakdown of the sets we have for flats. http://bcca-usbc-supplement.com/Rainier/SetList.aspx )
Scene: (12 Party, 6 Cartoon, 6 Brewery ) with a few variations of these also. I am in the process of showing all these here.
http://bcca-usbc-supplement.com/Rainier/Panels.aspx
Series: (One of the 3 different series)
Color:
Sub Color:
Finish: (Enamel or Metallic)
Size:
City:

I currently have about 50 cans pictured so I encourage people to check it out. As things slow down in other photography areas, I will be spending more time on this.

As for the 11 oz. cans, what I know about the KOL from Atlantic is that there was a six pack found years ago that most of them ended up in KC.
The composite posted is missing the Red Cap from Tacoma.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#20

Post by jinsequa » Sat Mar 16, 2019 3:11 am

From the picture, I have the following not pictured. (Honestly.... :smt102)
Bohemian Club FT 6
Brown Derby FT 1
Carling Black Label FT 2
Carling Red Cap Ale FT 2
Cascade FT 1 ..................Tab 1
Champagne Velvet FT 2
Heidelberg FT 2
Olympia FT 2
Rainier Ale FT 7.................. Tab 8
Rainier Exposition Ale FT 1

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#21

Post by MI-Cans » Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:49 am

All files in Post #5 in this thread revised based on info provided. Thank you.

I can see that the Rainier Jubes are going to be a problem. I am removing them from this composite and will start a separate one for just them. They are a completely different animal.

I appreciate everyone’s input. When done, maybe we’ll end up with a definitive and accurate list of these 11oz Flat Top Cans.

@Scott
I agree with your assessment as to the 11oz Rainier Jubes. They are in the “Brewery” series with six designs. When I create the new thread for these cans, I’ll include reference material form the BMV and the Landy/Wolpe/BCCA catalog.

Yes, I tried to sneak that Tuxedo 51 in but you caught me! I attempted to find all the 11’s in the supplement but when you’re scanning 5,000+ image texts, you’re bound to miss something. It gets kind mind numbing…if you know what I mean.

@J. Page
I’ve added the Red Cap Ale from Tacoma to the list.

Thanks for your explanation. I went to your series link and selected “Brewery” because that’s where the 11oz cans are in. You say there are 6 designs yet your link shows 7 spots??
Click to enlarge.
Brewery Series.png
2015 APR PAGE 07.png
@jinsequa
The list and image I put up are based on what’s currently in the Volume One Supplement. I can’t add yours until they’re added to the Supplement. Hope you can understand that.

It would be beneficial to those working on the supplement if you could provide images of the ten cans you mentioned. I’d suggest a frontal shot of each can. Then make sure that for each one, you include an image of the contents line showing 11oz, as well as an image of the variation you’re not seeing in the Supplement. You can either post the images here or pass them on directly to any of the people working on the Supplements. Their names have been posted here several times.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#22

Post by J. Page » Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:25 pm

@MI-Cans The additional panel in the brewery series will be a variation of the side panel in Set 22. The design is the same as
"More Life Naturally" but the slogan is "Beer with the light touch" Still need to find flat sheets to get the photos of some variations.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#23

Post by Longhorn Mike » Sun Mar 17, 2019 1:10 pm

The Schlitz 11oz from Longview, Texas is unusual because they all have an Oklahoma stamp on the bottom. These were shipped north to Oklahoma, not to the west coast like most of the 11oz cans.

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#24

Post by foreigncanman » Sun Mar 17, 2019 2:53 pm

Rocknchip wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:30 pm
Dude! I cannot believe you have the Kol from Atlantic!! Mystery can is no longer a mystery! Ive turned over a lot of KOL's too...I will have to start looking the $1 totes, I walk past them all the time...
I had a chance to upgrade the can but did not realize it was so tough.Someone pointed it out to me at a show but we already had one.
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#25

Post by Longopener » Mon Mar 18, 2019 2:39 am

foreigncanman wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 2:53 pm
I had a chance to upgrade the can but did not realize it was so tough.Someone pointed it out to me at a show but we already had one.
Don't forget to show a shot of the mandatory on the back of the Kol.
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Will trade a better examples, other cans or buy from you!

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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#26

Post by Scott » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:03 am

Here is a front and back photo of 11 oz. Kol from Spokane. I've also included the common one from Tacoma for comparison. Incidentally the one from Tacoma is still full and all original versus one of the thousands of unfilled examples that came out of the brewery.
Kol front.jpg
Kol Back.jpg
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#27

Post by Scott » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:08 am

Here are the 11 oz. Jubilees from my collection. The first photo which has more cans are all from Seattle. The second photo is Spokane. I'd never bothered to sort them this way before so had not idea I had quite a few more from Seattle. Whether that makes the Spokane ones more difficult or not I have no idea. Typically the places I go dumping are more often in the Seattle distribution area so that may be why. I also can't say whether all of the same cans that were made at one city were made at the other or whether every design was produced in every color.
Jub 11 Seattle.jpg
Jub 11 Spokane.jpg
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#28

Post by Rocknchip » Tue Mar 19, 2019 10:11 am

Love the Kol atlantic... lot more 11 oz jubes then I thought!
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#29

Post by waste-man » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:09 pm

I made a trip to the Davenport show Sunday and I picked up a Hamm's Draft SS flat top from LA 11oz. It looks rolled so I am not sure it is a real can but I seen to remember a few others popping up recently so I think it is a true variation.

waste-man
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Re: 11oz Flat Top Cans

#30

Post by waste-man » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:13 pm

There is also two variations of the Hamm's sunshine 11 oz 1 079 01 0. It comes from LA and San Francisco. Within those two there is a minor variation of the can ( They come with and without the trademark R in a circle on the face). Do not know if you get into that minor of variations.

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